Re: Large scale permaculture

In article 
<481c4b2e$0$14295$5a62ac22@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>,
 "FarmI" <ask@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 be given> wrote:

> "Billy" <wildbilly@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message news:wildbilly-
> > "FarmI" <ask@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 be given> wrote:
> >> "0tterbot" <spl@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
> >> > "FarmI" <ask@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 be given> wrote in message
> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Tut tut.  I'm sure you do care as I can't imagine that you could 
> >> >> possibly
> >> >> approve of the invasion of Iraq based on falsified information.
> >> >
> >> > i didn't, i don't.
> >>
> >> :-))  Thought not.
> >>
> >> > but i don't give a flying **** who the president of the usa is, & 
> >> > that's
> >> > the truth!! :-D whether i care or not i can't do anything about it,
so 
> >> > i
> >> > therefore don't invest any energy in caring about any of them.
> >>
> >> Well there is that.  Given how sick I am of the coverage of the 
> >> Democratic
> >> contest, by the time the real contest comes round to elect the new
> >> President, I don't think I'll give a flyer either.
> >>
> >> > honestly, all we are seeing is the bush effect - nobody in the
world 
> >> > wants
> >> > to see anyone like that in power again, EVER.
> 
> > Sorry to say but Bush isn't the problem.
> 
> Well he certainly isn't part of the solution either, but he and anyone
in 
> his position should be.
Is it just me? I'm feeling a whole lot of 'tude here. Are you reacting t 
what I said or what you think I said? If this is to be a conversation, 
then let's keep it in response to what is written.

Bush is guilty but he isn't the puppeteer who orchestrates the show. He 
is a political hack representing his moneyed backers over the interests 
of the electorate.
> 
> > If the new government doesn't go after the malfeasance of this
> > administration, then we are all in deep doo.
> 
> Welcome to our world Billy.  We had the a similar situation here for the

> past 11 years.  I have voted for both sides of the political spectrum in

> this country but I am very pleased that not once did I vote for anyone
in 
> the last Government.  By the time they got the axe, they too had become
a 
> weeping sore just as Bush seems to have done for you.  You get your
chance 
> next year but I have to say that so far I'm underwhelmed with your
choices.
You ain't the only one sister.
> 
> >> > oh dear. i think the truth is that most people worldwide are "a
bunch 
> >> > of
> >> > idiots". truly. the modern world is ridiculously complicated & lots
of
> >> > people simply can't keep up.
> 
> > Especially when their governments and the media present them with bald
> > faced lies or information that is so freakin' skewed, that reality is
> > imperceptible. If you're a democratically elected leader of a country
> > that opposes American foreign policy, you're a militant. If you're a
> > ruthless dictator who sup****ts American foreign policy, you're our
ally
> > for peace.
> 
> But I see that as the fault of a lazy public as all politicians will try
to 
> use that sort of idiotic brain wa****ng.  It's designed to manipulate
those 
> within the populace who are gullible and/or stupid.  Anyone capable of
any 
> degree of clear thinking should only be caught by it once.  How many
times 
> does Joe Public have to be bludgeoned over the head about whatever the 
> current political issue is, get all excited and whipped up because of
the 
> patriotic (usually) rubbish he's being spoon fed before he finally
starts to 
> think for himself and realises that the last time he was sucked in and 
> believed the lies, he felt like a total fool when it all came unstuck?
> 
> It seems that Joe Public either doesn't care or is too stupid to know
that 
> he's being manipualted.
> 
> With access to the internet, there is no way that anyone should accept 
> unquestioningly anything they are fed by the media.  The world is a big 
> place and access to all sorts of differing of views is only a few clicks

> away (or should be).
I don't know how Ruppert Murdock plays in Australia, but he is the most 
egregious example of media incompetence in America, but still, only the 
most egregious. Studies have shown that views of Fox News are worse 
informed than people who don't watch anything. Viewers of Fox News are 
still likely to think that Saddam Hussein had WMDs. The rest of the 
media here is similar. The hysteria from the "cor****ate press" and the 
"reputable" N.Y. Times, and Judith Miller, helped convince the country 
that intervention was necessary. They were aided and abetted by 
Gen.Colin Powell, who most of us thought was a good guy.

Nearly all of our the media depends on advertising (except for 
free-speach radio like Pacifica and some college stations), advertising 
that would disappear for an un-American media that didn't sup****t the 
government's declared intent of protecting the American people.
> 
> >> In the case of the Tampa and much else in the past 11 years it was a
case 
> >> of
> >> sinking backwards into the primordial ooze, not furthering the cause
of
> >> rational thinking or high human ideals.
I must have been asleep when this happened, thanks for bringing it to 
our attention. We do the same thing to Haitians all the time:-(
> >>
> > Speaking of rational thinking, it was good to hear one of your
> > countrym . ., hehem, citizens, Helen Caldicott, on the radio last
> > thursday, http://www.flashpoints.net/
. She is supposed to be starting
a
> > new radio programm soon on KPFT, Huston http://www.kpft.org/index.php
.
> > Always refre****ng to be exposed to reality.
> 
> I've only ever read a few of the things she has written and heard her a
few 
> times as she has mostly lived in the US.  What I have seen of her is 
> impressive, as at least she seems to be able to use her loaf.  Sadly
there 
> don't seem to be enough of such people around. 

Loaf? Typo or Aussi argot?
She seems to tour a lot. My understanding was that she was live from 
Australia and her guest David Lockebaum (sp?) could have been anywhere.
If You Love This Planet, hosted by Dr. Helen Caldicott
http://www.kpfa.org/archives/index.php?arch=26076
-- 

Billy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTfcAyYGg&ref=patrick.net
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=7WBB0svwMdY&feature=related